Wiki photos

Discussion in 'THE CROTON SOCIETY' started by annafl, Jul 16, 2013.

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  1. Crazy for Crotons

    Crazy for Crotons Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,050
    Location:
    south Tampa, Bokeelia
    Jerry and Phil,

    This is another plant that gets mislabeled very often. Perry and I thought it was Earl of Derby. Bob Alonzo said E. of D. was another name for Mrs. Fred Sanders. There went that theory.

    At one time, I thought it was Philadelphia but it's not that either. Philadelphia is consistently an oak leaf with non variable leaves. The plant in the photos is undoubtedly oak leaf but the leaves have much variability. No two leaves have an identical form. The real distinguishing characteristic is that Philadelphia develops dark red leaf undersides when mature (like General Paget). The plant in the photos (if it's the same one I have) has green leaf undersides. No one has ever been able to establish an ID for this one but it's an old plant for sure. It's found quite frequently up here in the older neighborhoods.


    Ana,

    Ricky's photo of Mother and Daughter is better than mine. Use that one instead. I'd use the one with the little pink spots (left) as per Bob Alonzo, this is the real mother and daughter. The purely red and green form is the uglier throw away sister.
     
  2. annafl

    annafl Esteemed Member

    Ray, I went ahead and put both photos in Mother and Daughter


    Today's entries:


    Mother and Daughter-Ricky Ginsburg and Ray Hernandez
    Jensenii/Warrenii-Marie Nock
    Coral Showers-Phil Stager
    Applause-Phil Stager
    America-Phil Stager
    Columbiana-Toby Rose
    Philip Geduldig-Toby Rose
    Tiffany-Toby Rose
    Judy's Beauty-Ron Kiefert and Randy Weisner
    Charles Rutherford-Randy Weisner
    Waterfall-Ron Kiefert
    Maximum-Ron Kiefert
    The Moth-Ron Kiefert
    Maryland-Ron Kiefert
    Rubens-Rick Leitner
     
  3. annafl

    annafl Esteemed Member

    Last entries for today:


    Claude Lorraine-Toby Rose
    Thea-Ricky Ginsburg
    Eleanor Roosevelt-Scott McIntosh
    Martha Brooks-Jerry Shilling
    Joe Friday-Jerry Shilling
    The Moth-Jerry Shilling
    Columbiana-Jerry Shilling
    Mona Lisa-Jerry Shilling
    Tiger Eye-Jose Lopez
    Christiana-Phil Stager
     
  4. Moose

    Moose Esteemed Member

    Messages:
    7,947
    Location:
    Coral Gables, FL Zone 10b
    This one was an unidentified from Dr. Frank Brown's garden. It really looks like General Paget, however - there is no reds on the leaf undersides. I checked the oldest leaves - only green & yellow. If not General Paget - what could it be ? :confused:
     

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  5. Crazy for Crotons

    Crazy for Crotons Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,050
    Location:
    south Tampa, Bokeelia
    Ron,

    I'll have to check later about the reddish undersides of GP leaves . Maybe I meant Maximum. It's one of those big yellow and green leaf varieties.
     
  6. fawnridge

    fawnridge Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,439
    Location:
    Western Boca Raton
    I have 6 General Pagget in the ground. None of them have any red.
     
  7. Kipjanet

    Kipjanet Active Member

    Messages:
    140
    Location:
    Zone 10 Miami Springs, Fl
    Welcome back Rags
     
  8. annafl

    annafl Esteemed Member

    Today's entries:


    Goldilocks-Photo by Jerry Shilling of Judy Glock's plant
    Survivor- Photo by Jerry Shilling of Judy Glock's plant
    Richard Krukonis-Photo by Jerry Shilling of Judy Glock's plant
    Confetti-Randy Weisner
    Van Buren-Randy Weisner
    Blotched Wooten's Beauty-Randy Weisner
    Pretty Bird-Marie Nock
    Nervia-Ana Bowers-yay! my first
    Diane-Ron Kiefert
    Voncilla Barley-Jerry Shilling
    Clipper-Jerry Shilling
    Carmen Christian-Jerry Shilling
     
  9. Crazy for Crotons

    Crazy for Crotons Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,050
    Location:
    south Tampa, Bokeelia
    Thanks Ricky. I guess it's Maximum with the reddish/brown undersides. Someone please confirm.
     
  10. annafl

    annafl Esteemed Member

    Last entries for today:


    Prince of Orange-Jerry Shilling
    William Jennings Bryan-Jerry Shilling
    Dreer 7-Jerry Shilling
    Waterfall-Jerry Shilling
    Charmer-Jerry Shilling
    Davis 1-Jerry Shilling
    Kentucky-Jerry Shilling
    Playboy-Ron Kiefert
    Duke of Windsor-David King
    Irresistible-Randy Weisner
    Lillian Stoffregen-Scott McIntosh
    Craig's Supreme/Craigii Supreme-Marie Nock and Ray Hernandez
    Quirko-Ray Hernandez
     
  11. ScotTi

    ScotTi Esteemed Member

    Messages:
    4,845
    My GP shows a little red on undersides of one branch only.
    IMG_2451.jpg IMG_2452.jpg
     
  12. ScotTi

    ScotTi Esteemed Member

    Messages:
    4,845
    Banana/Cornutum for Wiki.
    IMG_2453.jpg IMG_2454.jpg IMG_2455.jpg
     
  13. Phil Stager

    Phil Stager Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,644
    Location:
    Sunny St. Pete, FL
    Here's another one - the 'true' King of Siam. No, I did not make up the name either. It was a purchased with that name, and a few who have seen it have said that's what it is.
     

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  14. Jeff Searle

    Jeff Searle Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,753
    Location:
    South Florida, USA


    If there's no red, it's General Paget. Red underside it's a Maximum, or bender #2.
     
  15. Crazy for Crotons

    Crazy for Crotons Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,050
    Location:
    south Tampa, Bokeelia
    I would agree Phil. It's identical to the plant at Waimea Falls Park (Oahu) labeled by Dr. Brown himself.
     
  16. annafl

    annafl Esteemed Member

    I have several questions.

    Phil, should I put your plant in with the other King of Siam's saying this is the true form?

    Is Lamar's plant Noblis or Nobilis? Remember, I can't delete Cultivars if I put them on there wrong.

    Is Chrysophyllum the same or a separate name from Cryosophyllum, or does this name even exist?

    Is Cronstadtii the same or a separate name from Cronstadt or does this name even exist?

    Is Disraeli a synonym for Mrs. Snyder Disraeli, or is it a separate name, or does this name exist?

    Is anyone checking the entries daily? Has anyone looked at Victor Limone? These don't seem the same to me.

    Thanks.:D
     
  17. annafl

    annafl Esteemed Member

    Today's entries:

    Bender 2-Ron Kiefert
    Banana/Cornutum-Scott McIntosh
    Eburneum-Mike Harris
    John Bender-Mike Harris
    Johanna Coppinger-Mike Harris
    Purity-Mike Harris
    W.C. Wallace-Auction plant and David King
    Colonel Lindbergh-Mike Harris
    Jungle Queen-Jeff Searle
    Veitchii-Jeff Searle
     
  18. Crazy for Crotons

    Crazy for Crotons Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,050
    Location:
    south Tampa, Bokeelia
    QUOTE]I have several questions.

    Phil, should I put your plant in with the other King of Siam's saying this is the true form?

    Is Lamar's plant Noblis or Nobilis? Remember, I can't delete Cultivars if I put them on there wrong.

    Is Chrysophyllum the same or a separate name from Cryosophyllum, or does this name even exist?

    Is Cronstadtii the same or a separate name from Cronstadt or does this name even exist?

    Is Disraeli a synonym for Mrs. Snyder Disraeli, or is it a separate name, or does this name exist?

    Is anyone checking the entries daily? Has anyone looked at Victor Limone? These don't seem the same to me.

    Thanks.[[/QUOTE]

    Hi Ana,

    From what I remember Bob A. saying, Disraeli is a seperate cultivar from Mrs. Snyder's although I've never seen it.

    When in doubt about spelling, I'd do something like Noblis/Nobilis for the cultivar entry since the old book may have it misspelled.
     
  19. Native son

    Native son Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    873
    Location:
    10a
     
  20. Phil Stager

    Phil Stager Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,644
    Location:
    Sunny St. Pete, FL
    Anna - I'd put in in with all the other King of Siams
    ...and as you can see, alternate spellings are all too frequent and some go back many years...

    Phil
     
  21. annafl

    annafl Esteemed Member

    Today's entries:

    King of Siam-Phil Stager
    Stoplight-Mike Woolery
    Chili Pan-Chris Mayhew
    Coppinger's Hybrid-Chris Mayhew
    Pride of Winterhaven-Randy Weisner
    Rocio-Robertico in Costa Rica
    Van Houtti-Mike Harris
    MacAdoo-Ron Kiefert
    Dreer 7-Jeff Searle
    Super Petra-Jeff Searle
    Pop's Yard-Jeff Searle
    Rapture-Jeff Searle
    Nellie Halgrim-Jeff Searle
    Prince of Orange-Jeff Searle
    Cornelius-Jeff Searle
     
  22. annafl

    annafl Esteemed Member

    Last ones for today:


    Noblis-Lamar Sapp
    Leopardia-Ron Kiefert
    Ram's Horn-Ron Kiefert
    L.M. Rutherford-Jeff Searle
    Red Quill-Jeff Searle
    Cover Girl-Jeff Searle
    Monarch-Jeff Searle
    Sturrock's Pink Veitchii-Jeff Searle
    Limelight-Jeff Searle
    Tiger Eye-Jeff Searle
    Pitcarin-Jeff Searle
    Rubyi-Jeff Searle
     
  23. ScotTi

    ScotTi Esteemed Member

    Messages:
    4,845
    Is the picture of Maximum in the Wiki really Maximum? If that is really Maximum in the Wiki then the picture I posted ( post #91 G.Paget) is not a Maximum.
     
  24. Kingdavid

    Kingdavid Esteemed Member

    Messages:
    1,147
    Location:
    st lucie co
    I have a 15 year old what i thought was a Gen Padgent , it has 3 distinct types or colrs on the same plant , one of them has the dark red underneath , would that be a sport Maximum ....I ncluded the pictures #1 mother plant with all three different types #2 close up of the one possible Maximum #3 ,4, 5 all close ups of GP or Maximum ???? Help PLEASE
     

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  25. ScotTi

    ScotTi Esteemed Member

    Messages:
    4,845
    Check out the photo of Maximum in the Wiki....Do you think your plant looks like the one in the Wiki? Your plant looks like mine and looks nothing like Maximum that is in the Wiki. I have posted pics of mine before and was given the ID here a few years ago as G.P. and then the other day things changed. If mine is not G.P. then the pictures of mine in the Wiki need to be removed.
     
  26. Kingdavid

    Kingdavid Esteemed Member

    Messages:
    1,147
    Location:
    st lucie co
    Im more confused >>>>>>>> Of all my Gen P. None have the red underneath exept this one , I have 6 older ones At least 10 years old , and only the one branch on one plant has the red underneath and it has a different color all together ... David
     
  27. ScotTi

    ScotTi Esteemed Member

    Messages:
    4,845
    More shots of my G. Paget.
    IMG_2457.jpg IMG_2458.jpg IMG_2459.jpg IMG_2461.jpg
     
  28. Perry Edge

    Perry Edge Active Member

    Messages:
    126
    Gen. Paget sport.jpg P1060678.jpg Speaking of Gen Paget, this is a sport from one. Has anybody seen this sport before, and if so, does it have an established name? Also, can anybody identify the other croton?
     
  29. fawnridge

    fawnridge Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,439
    Location:
    Western Boca Raton
    Perry - the sport is a fairly common one, occurring best in full sun.
     
  30. Crazy for Crotons

    Crazy for Crotons Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,050
    Location:
    south Tampa, Bokeelia
    The Gen Paget sport is Julia Reasoner.
     
  31. annafl

    annafl Esteemed Member

    This morning's entries:

    Yellow Croc-Jeff Searle
    Magnificent-Jeff Searle
    Colonel Bob Bullock-Jeff Searle
    Confetti-Jeff Searle
    Babbett-Jeff Searle
    Father's Day-Jeff Searle
    Polychrome-Jeff Searle
    Limelight-Photo by Jerry Shilling of Judy Glock's plant
    Leota-Ron Kiefert
    Dreer 6-Jeff Searle
     
  32. annafl

    annafl Esteemed Member

    Last entries today:

    Julia Reasoner-Perry Edge
    Tiffany-Jeff Searle
    Madam Fernand Kohl-Jeff Searle
    Blotched Raphael-Jeff Searle
    Tropical Feel-Jeff Searle
    Showgirl-Jeff Searle
    Wooten's Beauty-Jeff Searle
    Cutler 34-Jeff Searle
    Sweet Marie-Jeff Searle
    Survivor-Jeff Searle
    Andreanum-Robertico in Costa Rica


    I've also been working on the synonyms little by little when time allows:D
     
  33. Native son

    Native son Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    873
    Location:
    10a
    Hi Perry, I think I have that one also. It is over by the boat with several I got from a meeting at U.S.F. Years ago. I saw the green/yellow interrupted in the back ground please, it to needs a name.
     

    Attached Files:

  34. Phil Stager

    Phil Stager Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,644
    Location:
    Sunny St. Pete, FL
    ..a few more pics to add to the confusion, Lamar and Perry. Both plants supposedly came from the same location in Bradenton. The first appears to be a yellow/green version of the second and more colorful one; both have pink petioles. No name was attached to them when I purchased them - probably at a USF sale. Both the yellow and the colorful versions sold at one of our recent get-togethers.
     

    Attached Files:

  35. Perry Edge

    Perry Edge Active Member

    Messages:
    126
    Yes, mine has the pinkish/reddish petioles too. I bought it at a nursery years ago, and have only seen it once again, at a different nursery. Naturally, neither were labeled.
     
  36. annafl

    annafl Esteemed Member

    Spent a frustrating morning trying to learn how to do links in blue font for the synonyms. Took a long time to do two! I will get the hang of it now, I think, but I'm going to take a break from it all now. Please keep adding photos as you can get good ones. No hurry if they will be in better color in another month or two. If it slows down a lot, maybe we can work on a seedling section. Think about that one! Ana
     
  37. Moose

    Moose Esteemed Member

    Messages:
    7,947
    Location:
    Coral Gables, FL Zone 10b
    Ana - definitely take a well deserved break. The photos will continue to get posted and will be waiting for you. Don't get burn't out.

    The Wiki has not been updated since Bren served as our moderator and Wiki guru. Would be nice if she came back and saw how you have added to all her hard work. Bren got burn't out, mostly from alot of BS she took as the Moderator.

    Bren come back - we miss ya! :D
     
  38. annafl

    annafl Esteemed Member

    I miss Bren also. I remember her from the Garden Web forum. I'd love to see her garden again. She did all the boring, tedious, reference work that's so needed in the wiki, but would not have been any fun for me. I'm sure that took a lot of her time. Great foundation to build on though!

    It's getting harder and harder to find more, confirmed, identified photos from past forum pages that have not already been put in the wiki. It takes quite a bit of time to find them, and in general, the farther back I go, the younger and less developed the specimens are. I appreciate newer postings with more mature, colorful and characteristic plants. No hurry, though. Fall is around the corner.


    Today's entries:

    Queen Victoria-Lamar Sapp
    Catherine Gephart-Andy Finlayson
    Davis Compacta-Lamar Sapp
    Poopsie McGuillicutty-Toby Rose
    Inca-Ricky Ginsburg
    Gloriosum Superbum-Ricky Ginsburg
    Craigii Supreme-Jerry Shilling
    Confetti-Jerry Shilling
    Leopardia-Jerry Shilling
    Cobra-Jerry Shilling
    Mango-Jerry Shilling
    Monarch-Jerry Shilling
     
  39. annafl

    annafl Esteemed Member

    Today's entries:

    Mango-David King
    Angel Wing-Ricky Ginsburg
    Charmer-Ricky Ginsburg
    Chrysophyllum-Jeff Searle
    Spirale-Jeff Searle
    Waterfall-Jeff Searle
    Polychrome group-Jeff Searle
    Chili Pan-Jeff Searle
    Oak Leaf Superba-Jeff Searle
    Lady Claire-Jeff Searle
    Richard Krukonis-Jeff Searle
    Royal Horseguard-Jeff Searle
    Eleanor Fischler-Jeff Searle
    Norwood Beauty-Jeff Searle (looks like Phil's plant that was already there)
    Rocio-Jeff Searle
    Colonel Lindbergh-Jeff Searle
    Playboy-Jeff Searle
    Princess Eugenia-Jeff Searle
    Yellow Duncan Macaw-Jeff Searle
    Catch of the Day-Jeff Searle
     
  40. annafl

    annafl Esteemed Member

    I have questions. Someone please respond.

    Under Richard Krukonis there is a red croton that looks more like President Reagan to me. Where does this photo belong?

    We need to establish criteria for placement of seedlings. Does Seminole Pride and Searle 2 belong in the croton encyclopedia or should we place these under a new seedling or new hybrid section? We need to start that soon. Please give me your thoughts.

    Is Jack Pot a legit name?

    We need to work on Satan/Irene Kingsley controversy. Can you all have a discussion on this again? I need to know where to put the Satan.

    Ricky, I didn't use any Bogoriensis photos because the two you already had in the wiki were the best ones.

    Ana;)
     

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