Croton Naming Conventions

Discussion in 'THE CROTON SOCIETY' started by fawnridge, Nov 21, 2011.

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  1. keith

    keith Active Member

    Messages:
    147
    Ray, grandma is #19 for you, but for me it may be #106 so whos number are we going to use LOL If grandma turns out to something different, Im all for calling it grandma. I have plants that I have had for years, other people have the same plant also. Im all for the croton group getting together and putting a name on these plants. If my purple people eater plant dies, I can call Jeff and he can root me another one. Im sure he would know right away which plant I want.
     
  2. Crazy for Crotons

    Crazy for Crotons Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,050
    Location:
    south Tampa, Bokeelia
    Keith, the numbering system I mentioned is only for my use. I don't expect others to use my numbering. It's just my naming method until the plant gets identified.

    Call a plant whatever you want for exchanging purposes but it should be a temporary name. Geisha Girl is a temporary name. The real name is supposedly so offensive that old timers won't reveal the real name.
     
  3. Phil Stager

    Phil Stager Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,637
    Location:
    Sunny St. Pete, FL
    Most of the old-timers were in the business of selling crotons. So they had to have a name for the plant and enough of them to sell. It matters lttle if they named the plant when it was a promising seedling or when they had enough for a new introduction. There was more than one scraggly seedling or one wierd sport. So for any kind of a long term name, it helps to have a lot of plants (same variety preferably). Names aid in communication, i.e., we're all taking about the same kind, type, variety or whatever. Naming a plant for a bit of ego gratification is just that.
    ...and what do we call the plant in another language? especially one that does not use the Roman alphabet like Thai?
     
  4. Moose

    Moose Esteemed Member

    Messages:
    7,947
    Location:
    Coral Gables, FL Zone 10b
    The "Grandma" scenario: The man who planted "Grandma" died in 1961, so it can surmised that this is an indeed old cultivar. Being such an old croton (hence the "temporary" naming of Grandma), I made air layers to preserve it's DNA. A definitive ID has not been made and may never be.

    I have distributed many air layered plants. Numerous forum members currently have this plant in their collection due to that distribution. It was my intention to have it spread around diffent gardens around the state for preservation purposes.

    Do I have the right to name this cultivar? :confused: The name "Grandma" is a temporary designation until some "experts" can get a look at this plant. This may take awhile, it may be three years before they see mature leaves on the distributed plants.

    There are some photos of "Grandma", in another thread on this forum, in her original condition. However, she was growing in nearly pure sand and rocks and un-fertilized for many years. This photo may not be a good indication of her potential.

    That being said, I feel that it may be appropriate to assign a temporary name to this cultivar. If we find that "Grandma" is in fact cultivar __________, it seems easier to get the word out that "Grandma" is __________. Calling it Unknown #19 in one collection and Unknown #106 in another adds to confusion in my opinion. People will remember temporary "names" better than numbers.

    When we found out that Island Breeze was really a White Ann Rutherford, the name transition was done rather easily. No one had to remember if Unknown #19, 106, 69, 666, etc ... was now White Ann Rutherford.

    Technically "unknown hybrid" is not a proper botanical naming since all crotons are the same species. When it comes to crotons, Marie Nock has suggested that someone who has intentionally crossed cultivars could say they have created a "hybrid". I agree with her on that.

    The naming of "sports" I believe has traditionally been done by the discoverer and cultivator of the "sport".

    Many of us collected and still do, other plants that have multiple species. That is why getting names is a practiced disipline and we are used to "tagging our plants". I like to know what my crotons are but am starting to let it go. If something looks interesting and unique, I will just grow it.

    I recently got a green & yellow croton from Phil as an unknown. I put on my tag, Unknown from Phil, "Stagerii" so I know its history. "Stagerii" will stick in my brain. Phil sums up the croton naming issue quite well with his signature closing:

    Onward through the fog... :cool:
     
  5. crotons.net

    crotons.net Active Member

    Messages:
    48
    Location:
    wpb
    re: grandma scenario this plant would actually be able to be named as you said it was planted in 1961 which would meet the 5 year criteria unless it was designated by experts to be another plant then it could be changed rather quickly as you say...........................................................and in the unnamed hybrid instance it would be unnamed 19 just because you gave air layers etc to people the designation would not change it would still be 19
     
  6. Moose

    Moose Esteemed Member

    Messages:
    7,947
    Location:
    Coral Gables, FL Zone 10b
    Why 19 ? :confused:
     
  7. Crazy for Crotons

    Crazy for Crotons Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,050
    Location:
    south Tampa, Bokeelia
    Wasn't that Maxwell Smart's assistant?
     
  8. crotons.net

    crotons.net Active Member

    Messages:
    48
    Location:
    wpb
    19 was from your scenario reread your post above
     
  9. Moose

    Moose Esteemed Member

    Messages:
    7,947
    Location:
    Coral Gables, FL Zone 10b
    Part of Keith's post: Ray, grandma is #19 for you, but for me it may be #106 so whos number are we going to use LOL If grandma turns out to something different, Im all for calling it grandma.

    Part of my post: Calling it Unknown #19 in one collection and Unknown #106 in another adds to confusion in my opinion. People will remember temporary "names" better than numbers.

    Still confused about why #19 ? I must be missing something here.

    It really matters not. __________ looks like a nice cultivar and I am happy I have it. :)

    Would be happy to share one with Crotons.net if they would like one. :D

    PM me if you like.

    Ron :)
     
  10. Crazy for Crotons

    Crazy for Crotons Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,050
    Location:
    south Tampa, Bokeelia
    I would never refer to my number #19 as such to anyone else. It's simply a means of tracking this plant in my own collection and for my own purposes. Once shared with someone else, they can call it Mud for all I care. Mud of course would have to be a temporary name ;)
     

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