Baron Franck Seilliere

Discussion in 'THE CROTON SOCIETY' started by Moose, Apr 1, 2014.

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  1. Moose

    Moose Esteemed Member

    Messages:
    7,947
    Location:
    Coral Gables, FL Zone 10b
    Baron Franck Seilliere 1.jpg Finally got an ID on this one. According to Mark Hooten, this is Baron Franck Seilliere. :)
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2014
  2. JoseLopez

    JoseLopez Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    261
    Location:
    Miami, FL
    Ron ,I saw this plant in a nursery in Naples and I was surprised to see it there because it is rare. At that time I could not remember the name of that plant. It's very interesting
     
  3. Phil Stager

    Phil Stager Well-Known Member

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    1,644
    Location:
    Sunny St. Pete, FL
    Could use a few close up pics of leaves with petioles and something for scale.
     
  4. Kingdavid

    Kingdavid Esteemed Member

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    Location:
    st lucie co
    Sure looks close to john Bender ????? Do you have any close ups ?
     
  5. Kingdavid

    Kingdavid Esteemed Member

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    1,147
    Location:
    st lucie co
    Some close ups . the more light the more yellow , some have roundish leaves some have less spots .... go figure . Im sure you have a bender but i was just making a guess . Does it have the purple petiles ?
     

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  6. Native son

    Native son Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    873
    Location:
    10a
    When John saw this one in my back yard years ago he said there is another name for that. He didn't say it was called John Bender, he just gave that grin. Ron do you remember how you got that one?
     

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  7. Jeff Searle

    Jeff Searle Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,753
    Location:
    South Florida, USA
    Ron,

    Is this one of the plants we grew from some cuttings a few years back that was collected at B. Franks yard?
     
  8. Moose

    Moose Esteemed Member

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    7,947
    Location:
    Coral Gables, FL Zone 10b
    BFS 1.jpg BFS 2.jpg BFS 3.jpg BFS 4.jpg
    Phil - here are some close-ups you requested. It has red petioles. Leaf shape is different than John Bender. Narrow shoulders that gradually widen, then has an ovate end with a pronounced point. Sorry, nothing for scale. Overall leaf length is above the dimension of a Baron Rothschild.

    This plant gets heavy sun exposure.
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2014
  9. Moose

    Moose Esteemed Member

    Messages:
    7,947
    Location:
    Coral Gables, FL Zone 10b
    BFS 5 S.jpg BFS 6 S.jpg
    No Jeff, not one of the Dr. Brown plants. Actually I got it at the auction we last had at Mike Harris' garden. And it came from Phil. Phil had no ID but may have recalled getting it at the Croton Society's booth at a USF Sale. When I was the winning bid, Phil refused to accept any $, told me "it's yours, enjoy it".

    Thanks Phil.

    By the way, the name came about from Mark Hooten. At the Glocks' Holiday Garden Tour, one of these showed up (It may have been Phil) at the auction. Mark had no reservations and made an immediate ID. I am sure the name spelling is correct, as I got it straight from Mark. Very happy to get another unknown named.

    Nice to know it is kinda rare and has some sort of history. Got to admit it is not a gorgeous big leaved colored up cultivar, but one deservedly that should be in some collector's gardens. Eye of the beholder. It is a candidate for someone wanting variegation in a sunny area.

    Here are a couple of close-ups from the shadier part of the plant.
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2014
  10. Phil Stager

    Phil Stager Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,644
    Location:
    Sunny St. Pete, FL
    Moose -- Here's the parent for that Baron FS - and a close look alike Long John Bender except for brilliant yellow.
     

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  11. Moose

    Moose Esteemed Member

    Messages:
    7,947
    Location:
    Coral Gables, FL Zone 10b
    The do have similarities. John Bender keeps its nice yellow veining in shade while the Baron will green up. Both have different leaf shapes.

    Here is a blotched sport of Baron Franck Seilliere. Sometimes the blotch is so heavy, there is negligible amounts of green. At times I have thought it would albino out but eventually it produces Baron Franck Seilliere 2.JPG BFS 7 B.JPG BFS 8 B.JPG green/yellow leaves again. I have been reluctant to take an air layer of the blotched sport, afraid it would cark. Attached to the mother plant it can steal carbohydrates.
     
  12. annafl

    annafl Esteemed Member

    How sure are we about this id?
     
  13. Native son

    Native son Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    873
    Location:
    10a
    IMO not sure at all, the name was given at the same time as many other names we take as true names. If there is some paper work that states historical facts OK but just an expert opinion, I don't know. AGAIN IMO it is John Bender.
     

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  14. Moose

    Moose Esteemed Member

    Messages:
    7,947
    Location:
    Coral Gables, FL Zone 10b
    It all depends if you rely on Mark's eye:

    the name came about from Mark Hooten. At the Glocks' Holiday Garden Tour, one of these showed up (It may have been Phil) at the auction. Mark had no reservations and made an immediate ID. I am sure the name spelling is correct, as I got it straight from Mark.

    When I got it at the last Garden Tour (auction) at Mike Harris', I believe Phil said he got it at the USF Sale years ago.
     
  15. Phil Stager

    Phil Stager Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,644
    Location:
    Sunny St. Pete, FL
    Moose - I recall that this came to me via Lee from a old residence in Bradenton. There's another colorful version, same leaf form, pink on petioles, etc. from the same house and it's somewhere in the yard here. Too late tonight for a pic --- but a quick look by flashlight shows it to be identical to another un-named and one called Long John Bender. My regular John Bender is in full sun and is not too good for any comparison. Are we having fun....
     
  16. kurt decker

    kurt decker Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    133
    Location:
    ft lauderdale
    john bender was a frank brown rename for his pal. that plant was a named plant prior to that, they all knew the name, but just changed it.
     
  17. Moose

    Moose Esteemed Member

    Messages:
    7,947
    Location:
    Coral Gables, FL Zone 10b
    John Bender 1.JPG John Bender 2.JPG
    Lamar - here is what I have as John Bender in heavy shade. The Bender seems to have more yellow then the Baron, which gets some heavy sun exposure. It may be hard to detect the differences from the photos I've posted. I am certain that if you saw both plants in person you would surmise that they are distinct cultivars.
     
  18. Phil Stager

    Phil Stager Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,644
    Location:
    Sunny St. Pete, FL
    That's what I thought also - but upon close comparison, they are all the same - even allowing for variable lighting conditions.
     
  19. Phil Stager

    Phil Stager Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,644
    Location:
    Sunny St. Pete, FL
    ..and a quick Google search gives some info on Baron FS - circa 12881 introduction by General Horticultural Company....
     

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